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Dave101 Guest
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Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:43 am Post subject: Heatsink Cleaning |
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| I have experienced high temps in my rig lately. It's due to the accumulation of thick dust particles on the heatsink fins. I want to clean it but I don't know the best method of cleaning the components in the VRM area around the CPU which also has dust. I want to use a brush but I might experience electro-static discharge which in turn might damage the board. If I use pressurized air, the dust can't be removed completely. I'm not a trained technician & I just want to make sure that safety is always prioritized. Please help..Thanks.. |
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Qwerty

Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 3141 Location: Germany
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Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:11 am Post subject: Re: Heatsink Cleaning |
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In my opinion pressurized air should be enough to remove the dust.
There are different types of aerosol cans with pressurized air for cleaning purposes. I use a "high-pressure" one - the blow is sufficient to remove any type of dust from heatsinks and components. The pressure is so high that the dust flies through the whole room. That's why I use a vacuum cleaner to catch the dust before it leaves the computer case.
There is one important thing to remember when using a vacuum cleaner - don't let it to absorb small, but crucial parts of your PC!
| Dave101 wrote: | | I have experienced high temps in my rig lately. It's due to the accumulation of thick dust particles on the heatsink fins. I want to clean it but I don't know the best method of cleaning the components in the VRM area around the CPU which also has dust. I want to use a brush but I might experience electro-static discharge which in turn might damage the board. If I use pressurized air, the dust can't be removed completely. I'm not a trained technician & I just want to make sure that safety is always prioritized. Please help..Thanks.. |
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Neon

Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 1512 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA
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Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:49 am Post subject: |
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I agree with Qwerty - use of pressurized air is usually the best method.
There are specialized anti-static vacuum cleaners, intended for safe work with electronics, but they are expensive. I have not used one, and cannot say if they are more effective than canned air.
It is good to use a computer case that is designed with filters at the air inlets. This helps to reduce dust accumulation on internal components. The filters can be removed, rinsed, and re-used as necessary.
Also don't smoke tobacco or other tarry substances near the computer. The tar in the smoke will accumulate on internal components, which is messy to clean up. This includes the fans, which may eventually fail. |
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johnorun

Joined: 04 Apr 2008 Posts: 3364 Location: Chicago, IL- US
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xrror

Joined: 23 Jan 2010 Posts: 83 Location: 61920-2262
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Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:23 am Post subject: |
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As long as it's not a super dry day (static electricity) I've had good luck with an old toothbrush or soft bristle paint brush to remove thick layers along with the canned duster. But like everyone else says usually a fresh can of "Compressed Gas Duster" gets most dust bunnies out of there. If there's a smoker in the house ugh... that transforms the bunnies into brown tarred dust mutants. That's when you have to use the brush, or just pull the board out and start spraying it down with 99% Alcohol ;p
ESD (electrostatic discharge) is one of those old gremlins that I think has become much more fear mongered than needs to be. It IS a threat, but you'll usually know when it's not a good day to work on electronics since you'll probably have been shocked a few times beforehand. At the very least I suppose, don't just roll out of bed and start prying stuff out of your computer before the morning cup of coffee or maybe don't work on your computer in a laundromat?
Just as long as the first metal/conductive thing you touch is NOT a circuit board, or something that GOES to something important (don't start licking the ends of your video cables for instance) you will probably be alright.
If it's a really bad static day, keeping one hand on your case frame (somewhere not painted preferably) on the assumption it's still plugged in and grounded will probably be enough. The golden rule is though that any time you "come back" to working on the computer be sure the first thing you touch is something "non-sensitive" like the case, and not something like a motherboard jumper or a stick of memory!
The times I've really zapped a component were usually when it was a dry winter day, a carpeted room with my shoes on, and I'd waltz up to the table and pick up something like a shiny new vid-card off the table... pop But luckily it didn't seem to kill anything important on it... but that's just dumb luck too.
The fear with vacuums I *think* stems from how most modern ones use plastic hoses/pipe which can create static electricity from airflow, but in my (unprofessional) experience if the environment is that dry and static prone, you'll probably already know since you would have shocked yourself touching the case beforehand. But like Querty said, the biggest problem is with a small enough nozzle you sometimes can suck parts off the board outright!
Air compressors are fun, but make sure you drain the water out of the tank before you start, and there is a very real risk if you shove the air blower attachment right up to the board, you can blow components off. |
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JAC

Joined: 24 Jul 2005 Posts: 3469
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Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:27 am Post subject: |
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I take my machine outside and blast it from all directions with compressed air*. DO NOT SPIN THE FANS LIKE A RETARD, put a stopper in them to stop them spinning.
If you manage to blow components off the board then give yourself a Gold Star Idiot award.
* using the airline from the machine shop - it has a moisture trap. |
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Guest
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Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:41 pm Post subject: |
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So I'd always heard that too, not to blow tons of air through your fans. Thus I took a small 40mm fan and hooked my multimeter up to the leads and started spraying the "Compressed Gas Duster" at it...
I got it up to around 2.5v lawlz... So yea. It really is true... don't do that. Imagine what a bigger fan would do! |
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CPUShack

Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 34259 Location: State of Jefferson, USA
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:12 am Post subject: |
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Its not just that, compressed air can and WILL spin a fan well above its design parameters, it will toast the bearings and brushes in a heart beat. _________________ New for 2025! The CPU Shack has a co-processor!
Visit The CPU Shack of microprocessor history and information. |
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6a6ar09a

Joined: 14 Oct 2009 Posts: 444 Location: Belgrade
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:21 am Post subject: |
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I agree, those small fans are so fragile and should not be abused but there are no bearings and brushes in them. This fans are the PMDC brushless motors. Actually, when you spin them using compressed air, they acting as generators (produce current) and it is possible to toast something on the board, if you go to far. _________________ www.chipmuseum.com |
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JAC

Joined: 24 Jul 2005 Posts: 3469
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| 6a6ar09a wrote: | | I agree, those small fans are so fragile and should not be abused but there are no bearings and brushes in them. This fans are the PMDC brushless motors. Actually, when you spin them using compressed air, they acting as generators (produce current) and it is possible to toast something on the board, if you go to far. |
What are you talking about? Any rotating axial shaft mounts into a bearing of some sort. Sleeve bearings being nice and cheap and quality ball slightly more expensive. There are others, they are the most common I see, especially in the type of fans used on motherboards. I have used a number of them in electronic projects over the years.
Bearing design is the subject of a lot of patent design. Manufacturers of motors, especially equipment fans and hard drive makers, have all kinds of crazy designs they like to tinker with and produce new "patents".
They are also almost exclusively brushless, and not just by desire, but to meet EMC emissions. The additional control electronics, usually some kind of hall effect sensor, is used to switch the coils. Blowing this sort of fan backwards will not simply generate a large DC voltage on the input leads, if anything I would expect some sort of whacky sinusoidal wave - anyway a lot depends on the actual electronics inside the fan, and manufacturers use ALL SORTS. If you measure anything you may also be measuring the fan rotation signal, but this again depends on the type of electronics within. |
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6a6ar09a

Joined: 14 Oct 2009 Posts: 444 Location: Belgrade
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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| JAC wrote: | What are you talking about? Any rotating axial shaft mounts into a bearing of some sort. Sleeve bearings being nice and cheap and quality ball slightly more expensive. There are others, they are the most common I see, especially in the type of fans used on motherboards. I have used a number of them in electronic projects over the years.
Bearing design is the subject of a lot of patent design. Manufacturers of motors, especially equipment fans and hard drive makers, have all kinds of crazy designs they like to tinker with and produce new "patents". |
OK, bearing with moving parts like "ball bearing" translated on my language is "lager" and bearing with no moving part (brass cylinder with whole) is "biksna"... (my translation/understanding mistake)
When I sad; no bearing, I meant; no "ball bearing".
I don't remember that I saw ball bearing in motherboard/processor fun.
( "lager" in Serbian have nothing in common with lager beer )
| JAC wrote: | | They are also almost exclusively brushless, and not just by desire, but to meet EMC emissions. |
That is the same as I sad; "no brushes", "brushless"...
(BTW, I don't know any motherboard/processor fun model, from any manufacturer, with brushes. Do you know? [you sad: "almost" exclusively])
| JAC wrote: | | The additional control electronics, usually some kind of hall effect sensor, is used to switch the coils. Blowing this sort of fan backwards will not simply generate a large DC voltage on the input leads, if anything I would expect some sort of whacky sinusoidal wave - anyway a lot depends on the actual electronics inside the fan, and manufacturers use ALL SORTS. If you measure anything you may also be measuring the fan rotation signal, but this again depends on the type of electronics within. |
Thanks for the info but, because of that "depends on the actual electronics inside" I am not so sure that ALL of them can not produce enough voltage to get you in trouble. Are you 100% sure? _________________ www.chipmuseum.com |
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CPUShack

Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 34259 Location: State of Jefferson, USA
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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Technically the motherboard is suppose to be protected from these transients (diode protection and/or others) but not always
Older boards, and case fans have had brushes, I have some laying about I am sure. _________________ New for 2025! The CPU Shack has a co-processor!
Visit The CPU Shack of microprocessor history and information. |
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6a6ar09a

Joined: 14 Oct 2009 Posts: 444 Location: Belgrade
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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Cool, thanks. It is god to know that. I have scraped dozens of them, some were broken... and I saw coils, magnet ring... so my conclusion was that some current could go out if you spin them, specially if you spin them to fast... (pressurized air)
Anyway, I will keep my old-fashion fun/heatsink cleaning way just in case... Disconnect first. _________________ www.chipmuseum.com |
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Guest
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Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="JAC"]DO NOT SPIN THE FANS LIKE A RETARD
OH SHIT I FEEL OF MY CHAIR FROM LAUGHING!!!! YOU ARE HILARIOUS> |
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SGINERD

Joined: 14 Feb 2010 Posts: 57
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Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:09 am Post subject: |
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I think we should all get some fans and just start blowing them with compressed air, then hold a contest to see what fans last longest!
SGINERD
JAC thats my comment above, just forgot to sing-in before posting. But I did
fall of my chair when I read that. Thank You! Oh and before you can say "who's the retard now for not signing in" I know.
Greetz |
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