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debs3759

Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 9477 Location: Northampton, Divided Kingdom
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 12:16 pm Post subject: What hard drive capacity will a UMC UM4981-AIO support? |
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It's been so long since I worked with a 486 system that I can't remember much about HDD support.
I have bought a UM4981-AIO Rev 1.0 on eBay, with AMD 5x86-133, VLB graphics card I wanted and sound card (that I won't need, but it's a bonus). I have a 528MB drive for testing old graphics cards that only have Windows 3.x support, but need an idea of the largest size drive that will work with LBA on this board for Win 95 and later OS.
The manual can be seen at http://www.elhvb.com/mobokive/archive/Systemax/Manuals/vlb/UM4981_Rev_2.PDF (can't find a Rev 1 manual)
The chipset is UMC 8498F
Any advice appreciated if anybody still knows about such stuff. No point buying 2 or 3 2GB drives (for different OS) if a 40 GB drive will work  _________________ My graphics card database can be found at http://www.gpuzoo.com.
I can resist anything except temptation.
Debs |
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CPUShack

Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 34259 Location: State of Jefferson, USA
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debs3759

Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 9477 Location: Northampton, Divided Kingdom
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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That's what I suspected. Hope it's not too difficult finding drives that small May have to post a wtb thread if I don't find them on eBay  _________________ My graphics card database can be found at http://www.gpuzoo.com.
I can resist anything except temptation.
Debs |
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Glory_Cloud

Joined: 24 Jul 2010 Posts: 2942
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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PM me as I get smaller IDE hard drives that I format and
make bootable to DOS. I should get a list of what I have
pulled together for everyone to peruse.  |
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debs3759

Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 9477 Location: Northampton, Divided Kingdom
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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Cool  _________________ My graphics card database can be found at http://www.gpuzoo.com.
I can resist anything except temptation.
Debs |
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misace

Joined: 14 Sep 2012 Posts: 932 Location: Prague, Czechia
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:41 pm Post subject: |
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You donīt need little drives. You can set the max. capacity of the HDD via HPA command. It works with all drives, BIOSes and OS. Iīm using MHDD utility for that.
http://hddguru.com/software/2005.10.02-MHDD/ _________________ Looking For Chips 386 J38605DX, Symphony FPU, Rise Tiger, MP6-II, Winchip 3&4, IDT C6-Early Logo, Nx686, Tesla 8088, L80C86, Bulgarian 8088, Pentium 4 QT69ES. |
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debs3759

Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 9477 Location: Northampton, Divided Kingdom
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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Looks like a useful tool for some things, thanks. I won't be using the HPA command to resize drives though unless I have to, I want to try using drives that go with the hardware as much as possible. Thanks to Glory_Cloud it looks like that shouldn't be a big problem  _________________ My graphics card database can be found at http://www.gpuzoo.com.
I can resist anything except temptation.
Debs |
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Qwerty

Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 3141 Location: Germany
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 1:16 am Post subject: |
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There are two possible HDD size limitations for a 486 system - 2.1 GB and 8.4 GB. That's why 2.1 and 8.4 GB hard drives are quite expensive on eBay.
Perhaps you should use a CF card with an IDE adapter instead of a HDD. The 8 GB compact flash cards are extremely cheap and have better performance than an old HDD.
If you want to use FAT16 on the machine then there is another size limitation of 2 GB for partitions. But in this case you can just create 4x 2GB partitions on a 8.4 GB drive.
Last edited by Qwerty on Sun Jul 06, 2014 1:49 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Qwerty

Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 3141 Location: Germany
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 1:33 am Post subject: |
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| misace wrote: | You donīt need little drives. You can set the max. capacity of the HDD via HPA command. It works with all drives, BIOSes and OS. Iīm using MHDD utility for that.
http://hddguru.com/software/2005.10.02-MHDD/ |
Are you sure the tool will work with older drives? They were pretty "dumb" - usually it was not possible to change the firmware settings using software.
The drives of that generation had jumpers for artificial size limitations. It is possible to limit a 3.2 GB HDD to 2.1 GB and a 10 GB one to 8.4 GB. |
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misace

Joined: 14 Sep 2012 Posts: 932 Location: Prague, Czechia
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:14 am Post subject: |
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HPA is part of ATA command V4. It is in firmware. It works on newer drives from ~2001. I used it many times to boot from old 386 and 486 machines.
| Qwerty wrote: | | misace wrote: | You donīt need little drives. You can set the max. capacity of the HDD via HPA command. It works with all drives, BIOSes and OS. Iīm using MHDD utility for that.
http://hddguru.com/software/2005.10.02-MHDD/ |
Are you sure the tool will work with older drives? They were pretty "dumb" - usually it was not possible to change the firmware settings using software.
The drives of that generation had jumpers for artificial size limitations. It is possible to limit a 3.2 GB HDD to 2.1 GB and a 10 GB one to 8.4 GB. |
_________________ Looking For Chips 386 J38605DX, Symphony FPU, Rise Tiger, MP6-II, Winchip 3&4, IDT C6-Early Logo, Nx686, Tesla 8088, L80C86, Bulgarian 8088, Pentium 4 QT69ES. |
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debs3759

Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 9477 Location: Northampton, Divided Kingdom
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:35 am Post subject: |
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| Qwerty wrote: | There are two possible HDD size limitations for a 486 system - 2.1 GB and 8.4 GB. That's why 2.1 and 8.4 GB hard drives are quite expensive on eBay.  |
Thanks, that clears up a few things. It's surprising how many people still use such old systems
| Quote: | | Perhaps you should use a CF card with an IDE adapter instead of a HDD. The 8 GB compact flash cards are extremely cheap and have better performance than an old HDD. |
i will be getting at least a couple of IDE drives between 1 and 2 GB, but it does seem the using CF drives will be more practical. Will the BIOS recognise them the same as a regular IDE drive with whatever adaptor I get? If so, I could potentially have a good selection ready to go with drivers set up for the most common cards I'm likely to be testing
Still got to pay for the mobo (that happens next week) and sort a suitable case that takes full length cards. Getting close to having the space so looking forward to some retro computing madness before the summer is over  _________________ My graphics card database can be found at http://www.gpuzoo.com.
I can resist anything except temptation.
Debs |
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Qwerty

Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 3141 Location: Germany
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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| debs3759 wrote: | | Qwerty wrote: | | Perhaps you should use a CF card with an IDE adapter instead of a HDD. The 8 GB compact flash cards are extremely cheap and have better performance than an old HDD. |
i will be getting at least a couple of IDE drives between 1 and 2 GB, but it does seem the using CF drives will be more practical. Will the BIOS recognise them the same as a regular IDE drive with whatever adaptor I get? If so, I could potentially have a good selection ready to go with drivers set up for the most common cards I'm likely to be testing  |
The CF cards have a full-fledged IDE interface (that's why they are much more expensive and used in professional photo equipment), only pin-out is a bit different. The CF cards will work with all adapters, as the adapters only change the pin-out. Be warned that all other card types like SD, SDHC, MMC and others don't have a native IDE interface and will not be recognized by BIOS even if you manage to find an adapter for them.
And of course only 2 GB or 8 GB types should be used with old systems.
Last edited by Qwerty on Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Qwerty

Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 3141 Location: Germany
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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| debs3759 wrote: | Thanks, that clears up a few things. It's surprising how many people still use such old systems  |
I have a 486 system with Windows 95a and a Pentium I system with Windows 95c installed.
I still use them from time to time (old DOS games) and currently considering to replace the old HDDs by CFs in order to avoid HDD failures in the future. |
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amstrad84

Joined: 30 Dec 2009 Posts: 137 Location: Prague, Czechia
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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SO, ideal HDD capacity for PC with 486 cpu is cca 270 MB for 6.22 DOS and 420/630 MB for Win95/98, while prefering WD, no Seagate.
 _________________ * Wanted i487 * \ ** P.F. 2019 to you ** |
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debs3759

Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 9477 Location: Northampton, Divided Kingdom
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Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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I'll be using a 540 MB drive for DOS/Win 3.11
Will possibly be getting a couple of drives around 1.2 - 1.3 GB that will be good for Win95/98. Will know soon what other similar drives are available.
I will probably follow the suggestions above for 2 GB CF drives to run 2K on it.
I was moving some stuff around earlier and came across a Super Socket 7 board with a K6-2 500 in it. That supports up to 8.4 GB and has an AGP 2x slot (and ISA/PCI slots). I'll probably use CF cards on that as well, same with the S370 board I want to test.
I think all my later boards have SATA so not yet sure whether I'll be using CF or SATA drives (will need to check prices for smaller drives for them). At least I now know I have some decent options for my graphics card testing lab (most people call it a sitting room!). _________________ My graphics card database can be found at http://www.gpuzoo.com.
I can resist anything except temptation.
Debs |
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